GoldFinger1969

KaileeS and other PMG Mods: the spammer continues to disrupt the boards, can you block their ID ? https://boards.pmgnotes.com/forum/38-us-and-world-notes/ These "topics" have NOTHING to do with currency or bills.

If they are there, we should see some increases in coming years. The populations for rare bill types PLUS super-low SN AND/OR high-grade condition....is very low. So if you are right Mike -- and you could be -- we should see creeping population bumps for these very rare bills in high-grades (even medium-grades). Remember...for many of the recipients of GCs and large denomination bills...they were either businesses or wealthy individuals who NEVER thought about preserving a bill for financial gain because quite frankly they were already rich or a business with plenty of $$$. How many individuals really wanted a $5,000 bill 100 years ago with or without the GC label...and in great condition...and then could afford to "sit on it" and not use the actual FV ? Maybe a true collector with big $$$. That's the good thing about being a coin collector back then...the FV's were much lower which meant you paid much less given many times the purchase price was just FV plus a nominal percentage. A $1,000 or $5,000 bill cost at least that amount.....every $20 Double Eagle was probably buyable for < $50 in mint state with the exception of the MCMVII UHR (even the MCMVII HR !!!).

Congrats....nice grade, EPQ is nice....I'm just not sure it adds much value since the bills are moderns and there are lots more like them. Best to check recent sales on HA, GC, or eBay. Even Silver Certificates from pre-1960 with PMG-58 or PMG-60's are not that pricey solo....and a unique SN (but not a super-low SN) won't jump the price too much.

You said it had a crease, which we couldn't see from the pics. That's reminiscent of my PMG-45 $10 Gold Certificate which from pictures looks like it grades mid-60's but does have creases or folds which I can't see unless I really angle the light and the bill. I guess you learned an inexpensive lesson: if YOU can see the crease or fold or blemishes....the graders will, too . Had you known it was gonna grade in the 40's, you probably wouldn't have submitted it I guess. Moral Of The Story: No matter how nice or crisp or fresh a bill from a teller or ATM machine....it is probably going to grade in the 40's, 50's at best.

But if it isn't "slabbed" how many of these people can correctly maintain their mint state bills over the decades ? It's more difficult IMO to properly preserve a bill than a coin. We're almost 40 years since the creation of the 2 main TPGs....that's a long time...how many people have accumulated bills since then OR had one for years/decades before the TPGs and...despite having a very valuable piece of currency....never sold it or submitted it ? I would think very few. Maybe an uninformed heir or heiress who is independently wealthy and for whom even valuable coins or notes doesn't change their lifestyle. But for even those considered "noveau rich" back 40 years ago I have to think a $500 to $5,000 bill maybe with the GC status and/or a super-low SN....you're talking a 6-figure note if in pristine condition. That 'aint chump change !!

I think this is bullish for buyers AND sellers....stronger hands with SB....shows long-term fundamentals intact.....WBA with SB attracts more buyers and gets more inventory. See how it shakes out, Mike.

Mike, how do you find pricing on ebay for your world/foreign bills and/or any U.S. currency you may have bought over the years ? I find the initial asking prices way high -- sometimes they are flexible, but other times they trim by 10% when they need to trim by 30% to be competitive.

So the HA archive allows you to check by SN or Low SN in their search engine ? I don't think I knew that when I played around with it a while back. Interesting, thanks Mike ! Yeah, The Unicorns -- multiple key traits -- makes it tougher. My point is....I don't think there are for the special bills -- Silver Certificate, Gold Certificate, Large Denominaton Bill, Large Denomination Gold Certificate, Hawaiian or North African bills, etc. -- both a low or super-low SN....AND....pristine graded condition...for lots of bills. A few, as you cited -- but not lots. I also can't believe with the passage of time we haven't seen the super-low SN's and high grades come out of whoever had them and the inheritor then submitted them for grading. All these valuable bills came out before 1945....most before 1934....if an adult got 'em, they're dead by now and their kid/inheritor has to be pushing 90 or more....so again, they should be changing hands IF they exit once the owner passes on. I do think today's modern bills (2000 and later ?) with super-low SN's (<10) are saved in high-graded condition even though I'm not sure they're worth lots of $$$. I think the high values for low-SN's of the past is precisely because most of the low-SN's were NOT saved and/or were not saved in HIGH graded condition.

I'd say under 100 because then you have six "zeros" in a row. Under 10 is definitely low by any standard, when 1 digit is your SN. If there are other Hawaiian $1 notes like mine....and they are in my grade (67) or close to it (65 or more ?), I would doubt there are enough survivors/certifieds from the PMG data (figure PCGS doesn't materially impeach the results): You can see that the population in my 67 grade is pretty narrow; even if you go down to 66 or even 65 you are talking a total of under 3,000 bills and most of those probably aren't even < 1,000 SN. Didn'tt know that 8-digits (or more) isn't the case around the world, interesting.

SN 00000086....not as low as my others but OK. I also have my Hawaiian note that is # 00000715 which is low for that bill and grade condition (67) but who knows how many are lower regardless of grade ? SN's aren't available from the databases. You wonder if the super-low SN's (<10) are often 40's or 50's condition like you see for some of the large denomination GCs where the low SN's at the time of printing were simply not saved by collectors in mint condition.

1928 Silver Certificate: Pretty nice bill; there are about 2,600 which have been graded 65 or higher. Just over 7,000 in total graded. The note is also a double-quad....2 sets of 4 numbers in the serial number.

Wait a second....at one time this bill had the PPQ or EPQ designation and LOST it ? And you think it was the same person buying this note over the last 24 years ?

Unlike with coins, Mike, you don't have any "floor" with bills and metallic content. For instance, Saints are down from decades ago because back then even though the gold price was LOWER.... the premiums to the bullion price were insane (500-700%). So MS-65's sold for almost $4,000 !! As you can see from my earlier post, the same bill was lower than earlier sales iin 2000 and 2009. It's also NOT too obscure a bill...and was in the widely-advertised HA auctions....so it's not like it just missed bidders selling on Ebay or some other obscure 2nd-rate sales place. Interesting, that's all I am saying.

Here's the one that sold for $1,100 back in 2000 and $805 in 2009 yet with bp last night only reached $660. Pretty cool SN of 00000400. https://currency.ha.com/itm/small-size/federal-reserve-bank-notes/fancy-serial-number-fr-1880-g-50-1929-federal-reserve-bank-note-pcgs-very-choice-new-64/a/142413-84458.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515 "Fancy Serial Number Fr. 1880-G $50 1929 Federal Reserve Bank Note. PCGS Very Choice New 64. "The only low or fancy numbers listed by Oakes for the Chicago district $50 are numbers 200, 300 and 400, all of which were discovered as part of the Davenport, Iowa Bank & Trust Co. cash hoard. Our consignor obtained this in a 2000 sale, when it realized $1100. Expect it to bring more, perhaps considerably more, in this offering." This was our description when we sold this same note for $805 in our 2009 FUN sale from the Robert Moon Collection. At that time, it was housed in a PCGS Very Choice New 64PPQ holder." What are "obsoletes" ?

I have to study the auction results in detail and go over them more in-depth...but after watching a few dozen auctions last night besides stuff I considered bidding on, the following observations: Lower-priced stuff is attracting lots of bidders and stuff is going ABOVE the HA estimates. This stuff is affordable to folks with $50 - $500 or so. Higher-end stuff sells, but lots of stuff wasn't reaching the HA estimate. I saw some stuff like Gold Certificates and other special bills sell for under the HA estimates and in a few cases 30% or more BELOW what they sold for 15-20 years ago in some family auction of bills. Very surprised to see stuff not at least matching a sale from that long ago....there wasn't a bubble in currency that I know of, so you would think unless a bidding war broke out that today's sales should match/exceed prices from that long ago. Older GCs and SC's continue to get strong bidding in medium-to-low grades. Not my cup of tea but folks like these and other larger bills. $500 and $1,000 bills in medium and lower grades selling for 3-4x FV.....high-50's and mid-60's you have to pay up 5-7x.